On Sat, Mar 5, 2011 at 3:46 PM, chungsterama <chungsty@yahoo.com> wrote:
> IMO, the real "stupid fucktards" are the APs who never got AC's message.
30K coin-in counts as "pounding"?
> From the casino's perspective, the 10X coupons are being used to
> promote business and reward their "good customers"
If that were the goal then wouldn't a smarter method be to send a
targeted mailing to those "good customers" and make the multiplier
available only to them, instead of inserting them into a newspaper with
6-digit circulation?
> and that is the CASINO'S right.
Absolutely, but if rewarding their good customers was really the goal,
they picked a stupid way to go about it. But I agree with you that
they're entirely within their rights and that it shouldn't exactly come
as a surprise to APs.
Re: [vpFREE] Re: Coast Connection Today
Re: [vpFREE] Re: "BIG teams became extinct due to IRS pressure"
On the other hand, you could have the desire to win...
Without cheating.
That's my bag, anyway.
--- On Sat, 3/5/11, kcace1024 <cy4873@hotmail.com> wrote:
From: kcace1024 <cy4873@hotmail.com>
Subject: [vpFREE] Re: "BIG teams became extinct due to IRS pressure"
To: vpFREE@yahoogroups.com
Date: Saturday, March 5, 2011, 9:36 PM
Frank,
Your posts are always entertaining and I am looking forward to reading your book because I have that availability bias thing from reading your posts.
However. I would not claim to know that a poster meant "everyone he knows" instead of "EVERYONE." Actually there are a number of possibilites for what the poster is really saying. He may not know anyone who has admitted not reporting taxable income, but his opinion of human nature is that everyone (100%) will underreport or not report cash income if they believe they can get away with it. He may mean 99% and is just rounding up to 100%.
Many people apply a different morality to "cheating" involving taxes, insurance, big corporations, etc. There is another morality for those playing sports where cheating is actually secretly and not so secretly admired by many. I have been told that if I am not willing to cheat then I really don't have the neccesary desire to win.
Chris
--- In vpFREE@yahoogroups.com, "Frank" <frank@...> wrote:
>
> Answer Part 1
> Well I'm sure when he said, "everyone", he meant "everyone I know". It's called availability bias. Basically it's people's general inability to see beyond their own personal experience, or understand how limited a single life is in the grand scheme of things. It's normal and nothing to be ashamed of. We all do it, myself included.
>
> Answer Part 2
> As to your second question about the honesty of machines. You asked, "Can someone clear this for me?". Well no, if we have learned anything from my answer to part 1. I can tell you of my own limited personal experience, but I certainly haven't played every machine in every casino and applied the Chi Square test to an appropriate sample size.
>
> So here's my answer take it for what it is. In the 21 long years I've been in gaming I've been personally privy to one instance of non-random machines. As you may know I was manager of a large VP team and have a fairly large sample size. It occurred at the old Silver Slipper. The machines were reported to Gaming Control, they sent out a tech and removed them the next day. A lot of people lost their jobs and the company that had made them went out of business.
>
> Other than that one instance, I've never seen anything to keep me up at nights about the fairness of machines in Nevada in general. Keep in mind a single person playing non-stop for a year can make no certain assumptions about anything based on their results. You need millions of hands to even have a glimmer of certainty. That used to be about a week of action for the team.
>
> ~FK
>
>
>
> --- In vpFREE@yahoogroups.com, Nordo123@ wrote: In regards to Mike's post EVERYONE who gets paid in cash "cheats", I consider myself a subset of "EVERYONE". Last year I won $125 at a video poker tournament. No paperwork, W2G, or Misc income form. I was paid in cash. I reported the $125 as a contest win on my taxes. I am worried however about video poker machines that are not honest. I keep hearing stories. Can someone clear this for me?
>
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
[vpFREE] Re: "BIG teams became extinct due to IRS pressure"
Frank,
Your posts are always entertaining and I am looking forward to reading your book because I have that availability bias thing from reading your posts.
However. I would not claim to know that a poster meant "everyone he knows" instead of "EVERYONE." Actually there are a number of possibilites for what the poster is really saying. He may not know anyone who has admitted not reporting taxable income, but his opinion of human nature is that everyone (100%) will underreport or not report cash income if they believe they can get away with it. He may mean 99% and is just rounding up to 100%.
Many people apply a different morality to "cheating" involving taxes, insurance, big corporations, etc. There is another morality for those playing sports where cheating is actually secretly and not so secretly admired by many. I have been told that if I am not willing to cheat then I really don't have the neccesary desire to win.
Chris
--- In vpFREE@yahoogroups.com, "Frank" <frank@...> wrote:
>
> Answer Part 1
> Well I'm sure when he said, "everyone", he meant "everyone I know". It's called availability bias. Basically it's people's general inability to see beyond their own personal experience, or understand how limited a single life is in the grand scheme of things. It's normal and nothing to be ashamed of. We all do it, myself included.
>
> Answer Part 2
> As to your second question about the honesty of machines. You asked, "Can someone clear this for me?". Well no, if we have learned anything from my answer to part 1. I can tell you of my own limited personal experience, but I certainly haven't played every machine in every casino and applied the Chi Square test to an appropriate sample size.
>
> So here's my answer take it for what it is. In the 21 long years I've been in gaming I've been personally privy to one instance of non-random machines. As you may know I was manager of a large VP team and have a fairly large sample size. It occurred at the old Silver Slipper. The machines were reported to Gaming Control, they sent out a tech and removed them the next day. A lot of people lost their jobs and the company that had made them went out of business.
>
> Other than that one instance, I've never seen anything to keep me up at nights about the fairness of machines in Nevada in general. Keep in mind a single person playing non-stop for a year can make no certain assumptions about anything based on their results. You need millions of hands to even have a glimmer of certainty. That used to be about a week of action for the team.
>
> ~FK
>
>
>
> --- In vpFREE@yahoogroups.com, Nordo123@ wrote: In regards to Mike's post EVERYONE who gets paid in cash "cheats", I consider myself a subset of "EVERYONE". Last year I won $125 at a video poker tournament. No paperwork, W2G, or Misc income form. I was paid in cash. I reported the $125 as a contest win on my taxes. I am worried however about video poker machines that are not honest. I keep hearing stories. Can someone clear this for me?
>
[vpFREE] Paris promo?
Does anyone know if this is open to anyone or just if you received the
e-mail blast?
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?a=2528744>
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et/harrahs/5871_245467.gif
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<http://click.harrahs-marketing.com/r/K4M26E/QGQW3/187RTY/PTUFE5/PRVIAB/4V/h
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?a=2528744> TOTAL REWARDS
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?a=2528744> $100,000 Secret Rendezvous March 18-20, 2011
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[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
[vpFREE] Re: We Luv Locals
Same goodies in a couple of slant-top banks at the Fiesta Henderson, next to the craps tables. Also mislabled faceplates. No signs. $1=1 point.
--- In vpFREE@yahoogroups.com, "st.tropez97" <st.tropez97@...> wrote:
>
> --- In vpFREE@yahoogroups.com, "vegasvpplayer" <vegasvpplayer@> wrote:
> >
> > Tonight I saw at both Boulder Station (near the
> > sportsbook) and Texas Station (outside the Bingo
> > room) a bank of MG/MD slants with "New" signs on
> > top. The machines all have 12 games and at a
> > quick glance I would say that at the 25c/50c/$1
> > denomination all games are in the area of
> > 99 - 99.8% return. Among the offerings are
> > 9/6 JB, 8/5 BP, 9/6 DDB, 9/7 DB, 9/6 BPD,
> > 9/5 SDB, 8/5 Aces Bonus, NSUD, etc. I wouldn't
> > be surprised if all Station Casinos don't have
> > at least one bank of these machines.
>
> Thanks for this info.
>
> I found these same machines at Red Rock today on four slants between the slot club and sportsbook bar. In addition to the games you listed, they had two more over-99% games, 9/5 TB+ and 9/4/4 BDW.
>
> No sign of $4 coin-in per point on these either.
>
[vpFREE] Did Dancer visit Ellis?
They have removed the 5 machines with the penny games and quarter-NSUD.
They have been replace with 4 machines that have Jacks or Better. but
since people were playing them [only 3 were working] I couldn't inspect
the paytables of the games on the machines. Only other game may be the
quick quads, but I don't know anything about the game.
DC-Mike
[vpFREE] Re: Coast Connection Today
--- In vpFREE@yahoogroups.com, King Fish <vpkingfish@...> wrote:
>
> You did an excellent job of misunderstanding or misconstruing what I was saying.
King Fish, do us a favor and read the memo.
Re: [vpFREE] XVP: The Commando hits a 12 against a dealer 4
Interesting story Mickey. Reminds me of my Spanish 21 playing days. Over
here on the East Coast we have 99.6% Spanish 21, with some hi-low counting
its a 99.8% game, and by playing $50 minimum tables, I can actually get
better comps than video poker. Trouble is, the players. To play effectively
, You DONT play blackjack strategy . You must make moves that upset the BJ
ploopies . I almost got killed once when I hit a 16 against a 2. "Are you
Certain" says the dealer. Only a fool would do that ...says player #2, etc.
Was dealt a 5 for a 6 Card 21 and got paid 2X on the spot. Wouldn't you know
it, the Dealer ended up with a twenty one, and I was held responsible by
some connected looking guys at the table !
----- Original Message -----
From: "Mickey" <mickeycrimm@yahoo.com>
To: <vpFREE@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Saturday, March 05, 2011 10:03 AM
Subject: [vpFREE] XVP: The Commando hits a 12 against a dealer 4
> On last night's Gambling With An Edge Bob Dancer used "The person on 3rd
> base controls the fate of the blackjack table" as an example of popular
> misconceptions in gambling. This reminds me of a story.
>
> Once upon a time the Fremont Street Commando walked into Jackrabbit Red's
> casino. He was looking to play some blackjack. It was just a little grind
> joint with just a few blackjack tables, but they dealt single deck with
> Vegas Rules.
>
> The joint was busy, especially the pit. But the Commando seen a 3rd base
> seat open on one of the tables. He layed a hundred on the table. The
> dealer cracked it then started shuffling up. The Commando placed a $20
> bet as he looked over the players at the table. Just a bunch of Vegas
> working stiffs he surmised.
>
> The dealer winged the cards out. The other player's boards showed K, 2,
> 3, 6, 8. The Commando caught a Ten and a 2. The dealer showed a 4. The
> Commando used a simple plus/minus. The count was minus 3. Now the
> Commando is looking in case anyone flashes a hole card as they take a hit.
> No one flashed a card and everyone stood pat.
>
> The Commando made the motion for a hit and the dealer peeled over a queen
> busting out his hand. The Commando pitched his cards over and went to
> place another bet. But then he heard....
>
> "HEY!!! WHAT THE HELL ARE YOU DOIN' HITTIN' A STIFF AGAINST A STIFF!!!"
> It was the guy on his right.
>
> "What?" the Commando asked
> "YOU JUST HIT A DAMN STIFF AGAINST A DEALER STIFF!!!" the man replied.
>
> The dealer rolled his hole card over showing a Queen. Then he peeled off
> a 7 to make twenty-one. The table erupted as the dealer raked in the
> chips and cards. The Pit Boss had his back to the table but heard the
> commotion. He turned and looked.
>
> "I STAYED ON A 12, YOU IDIOT!" the 4 seat yelled.
> "JESUS CHRIST!! WHERE YOU FROM, ROOKIE?" said the 1 seat.
>
> Through his peripheral the Commando seen a man in a suit standing back
> from the table but staring at him. It was the Pit Boss.
>
> "Well, look guys. We ARE in Vegas. Gambling is allowed here isn't it?"
> replied the Commando.
>
> "YOU TOOK THE DEALER'S BUST CARD, DUMMASS!!" the 2 seat said.
>
> The dealer went to winging the cards but a hand shot in front of the
> Commando's chips.
>
> "Deal him out!" the Pit Boss said. "Sir, may I have a word with you away
> from the table?"
>
> "Sure" the Commando replied. They walked several feet away from the
> table.
>
> "Look' the Pit Boss said. "It's all obvious to me. These people never
> seen anyone hit a 12 against a four before. But I have. I'm gonna have
> to ask you not to play. You're welcome to play anything else in the
> house, but not blackjack.
>
> "Okay" the Commando said. "I'll just grab my chips."
>
> He went back to the table, grabbed his chips, walked to the cage and
> cashed out. He passed back by the blackjact table on his way to the door
> and heard....
>
> "Thanks for gettin' rid of the idiot."
>
> "No problem" said the Pit Boss. "Don't worry folks. He won't be messing
> the game up any more."
>
> "Some days I just can't make a friend in this town" the Commando said to
> himself as he walked out the door.
>
>
>
>
RE: [vpFREE] Re: Coast Connection Today
<<And before anyone hires a lawyer, get a copy of the rules to the slot club
because that is a contract. Your use of the slot card is acceptable of said
contract. I am not a lawyer but contract law is not quantum physics and
every slot club contract that I read says something to the effect
"management reserves all rights." The courts will tell APs, if you don't
like the terms of the contract, then don't enter into said contract>>
Contract law is a bit more complicated than that. "Management reserves all
rights" doesn't mean anything. And casinos are beholden to gaming
regulations in addition to contract law.
Cogno
Re: [vpFREE] Re: Coast Connection Today
On Sat, Mar 5, 2011 at 4:48 PM, King Fish <vpkingfish@gmail.com> wrote:
> Ellis Island does a double royal promotion, is surprised by the action
> and starts barring people after less than two hours.
Sorry, I meant Jerry's Nugget. No idea where EI came from.
Re: [vpFREE] Re: Coast Connection Today
On Sat, Mar 5, 2011 at 3:46 PM, chungsterama <chungsty@yahoo.com> wrote:
> ... stop blaming casinos for acting in their own best interest. It's absolutely shocking to "stupid
> fucktards" that casinos would act in their own best interest (sarcasm intended!).
You did an excellent job of misunderstanding or misconstruing what I was saying.
Tuscany does a double jackpot promotion, is surprised by the action
and calls it off after less than two hours.
Ellis Island does a double royal promotion, is surprised by the action
and starts barring people after less than two hours.
Suncoast does 10X points, is surprised by the action and starts
barring people after less than two hours.
Now, if I were in charge of a casino I would certainly want to keep
APs from thinking it was worth it to play there. I might even 'bar'
some, but I would do it politely. Like the Silverton, who sent me a
nice polite letter saying I was no longer eligible for mailer,
multipliers, promos, drawings etc.
But that's not what we're talking about. If I'm in charge of a casino
and one of my managers creates a situation where their solution is to
cut a promo short or bar (or trespass!) people for nor more than
showing up to whey when they were invited to do so, then I would fire
that imbecile because he doesn't understand gambling and he's too
stupid to continue to work for me.
Controlling APs' ability to make money from you is understandable.
Reacting to these situations by barring and trespassing people is
ham-handed and reactionary.
But it's the part where they're surprised by what happens that makes
them idiots. Gambling is their core business, and they show by their
actions (both the ones related here and others that were not) that
they don't know as much about it as they should. That, and the way
they handle their mistakes, is why I consider them stupid fucktards.
If I ran the casino, it would be in the casino's best interest not to
have these reactionary mouth breathers working there.