Re: [vpFREE] Plaza $149 2 nights w/ $300 slot play, massage, $50 food credit, 4 show tickets

Thanks for the tip.

Forgive what are probably naive questions,but:


What are promotional machines" ?

Does the Plaza have more than one "show"?

On Sun, Mar 18, 2012 at 6:41 PM, Tahoe Local <att@flemingink.com> wrote:

> **
>
>
> Here is some money to be made, the $300 slot play is NOT on promotional
> machines!
>
> http://www.livingsocial.com/escapes/285538?offer_id=4
>
> A Two-Night Stay for Two, Sundays through Thursdays ($149) or Fridays and
> Saturdays ($289)
> Four Live Show Tickets
> $300 in Slot Play
> In-Room 50-Minute Swedish Massage
> Daily $25 Breakfast Credit at Island Sushi & Hawaiian Grill
>
> Must use by Dec 27, 2012. Blackout dates April 16-19, June 8-10, July 5-7,
> Sept 14-15, Oct 29-31. Refundable within 30 days if you change your mind
> through LivingSocial.
>
>
>


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

------------------------------------

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[vpFREE] Re: What Would It Take???

 

The only thing I would say for sure is the (correct) calculated return for 9/6 JB is based on solid mathematics and is not subject to any luck or any external factors. It is simply the overall return you get if you played every possible hand correctly (to maximize overall EV).
The overall return for 9/6 JB for perfect play is 99.5439+ (I have to look up the precise figure)

--- In vpFREE@yahoogroups.com, "johnnyzee48127" <greeklandjohnny@...> wrote:
>
> I understand the Admin's view point, but I think this is a very valid discussion for VP Free and would have widespread interest the VP Free community as a whole. I think the number of people who have never doubted the fairness of machines at some point in their career is a very small number. I consider myself a pretty good gambler, vp player and am pretty confident with the math behind the games but when I was playing vbj and busted my 12 vs 2 what seemed like 20 times in a row, I started to wonder about the 'fairness' of the game. Of course, when I sat down and actually counted the times I got 12 vs 2 and the number of times I busted, it was right in the center of the expected value distribution.
>
> But, the same question applies to this very simple case. My hypothesis was that my holding of 12 vs dealer 2 busted more than the expected value. Depending on the composition of the 12, my probability of busting is either 16/49 or 15/49( single deck game, reshuffle after every hand). How many samples do I need, and what result will either confirm or refute my hypothesis?
>
> Just because vpfree adheres to the belief that VP machines are fair doesn't mean I shouldn't know how that is calculated and what goes behind the statement. Just accepting a statement as fact doesn't teach you anything.
>
> VPfree also accepts the premise that 9/6 JOB is a 99.54% return ( to 2 decimal places) but a discussion of how you get to that number would certainly be valid.
>
> If I decide to play a little recreational roulette ( like the $0.25 game at the Westin 5-8 M - Th) and I bet on 17 and 60 spins go by without a 17, what does that tell me? How about 100 spins? 200 spins?
> I think this is an excellent topic for VP Free. Just because some people will get all wound up on the topic doesn't mean it shouldn't be discussed.
>
> One vote to open this topic up to discussion.
>
> --- In vpFREE@yahoogroups.com, vpFREE Administrator <vpfree3355@> wrote:
> >
> > From the vpFREE FAQ:
> >
> > "vpFREE believes that video poker games which are regulated
> > by respected gaming commissions are random and fair, and
> > that the ER of such games is a mathematical function of
> > their pay tables."
> >
> >
> > I've deleted Frank Kneeland's "What Would It Take???" post on vpFREE and re-posted it on FREEvpFREE.
> >
> > Formulating the required parameters to mathematically prove, or disprove,the randomness of video poker offerings is an interesting and important subject, but it may not have widespread interest for vpFREE members and it would likely prove to be disruptive.
> >
>

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[vpFREE] Re: What Would It Take???

 



--- In vpFREE@yahoogroups.com, "johnnyzee48127" <greeklandjohnny@...> wrote:
> One vote to open this topic up to discussion.

I also agree. I think a compromise is in order in that it should be tried on here. If it degenerates to a p****** match, then it can be moved. Give it a fair shot, possibly even with some moderate moderating.

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Re: [vpFREE] Re: Great deal at the Plaza

 

Just the $300 slot play for $149 is a great deal, not even counting the room nights, food. Shows and massage. I just bought one.
http://www.livingsocial.com/deals/285538?ref=email-jp&rpi=52512928

Pat McCauley
>
>
>
> >
>
>

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

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[vpFREE] Jean Scott's Frugal Vegas LVA BLOG - 18 MAR 2012

 

Jean Scott's Frugal Vegas LVA BLOG - 18 MAR 2012

"Las Vegas Changes"

http://jscott.lvablog.com/?p=1911

<a href="http://jscott.lvablog.com/?p=1911">
http://jscott.lvablog.com/?p=1911</a>

*************************************************
This link is posted for informational purposes
and doesn't constitute an endorsement or approval
of the linked article's content by vpFREE. Any
discussion of the article must be done in
accordance with vpFREE's rules and policies.
*************************************************

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[vpFREE] Plaza $149 2 nights w/ $300 slot play, massage, $50 food credit, 4 show tickets

 

Here is some money to be made, the $300 slot play is NOT on promotional machines!

http://www.livingsocial.com/escapes/285538?offer_id=4

A Two-Night Stay for Two, Sundays through Thursdays ($149) or Fridays and Saturdays ($289)
Four Live Show Tickets
$300 in Slot Play
In-Room 50-Minute Swedish Massage
Daily $25 Breakfast Credit at Island Sushi & Hawaiian Grill

Must use by Dec 27, 2012. Blackout dates April 16-19, June 8-10, July 5-7, Sept 14-15, Oct 29-31. Refundable within 30 days if you change your mind through LivingSocial.

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[vpFREE] Re: What Would It Take???

 

I understand the Admin's view point, but I think this is a very valid discussion for VP Free and would have widespread interest the VP Free community as a whole. I think the number of people who have never doubted the fairness of machines at some point in their career is a very small number. I consider myself a pretty good gambler, vp player and am pretty confident with the math behind the games but when I was playing vbj and busted my 12 vs 2 what seemed like 20 times in a row, I started to wonder about the 'fairness' of the game. Of course, when I sat down and actually counted the times I got 12 vs 2 and the number of times I busted, it was right in the center of the expected value distribution.

But, the same question applies to this very simple case. My hypothesis was that my holding of 12 vs dealer 2 busted more than the expected value. Depending on the composition of the 12, my probability of busting is either 16/49 or 15/49( single deck game, reshuffle after every hand). How many samples do I need, and what result will either confirm or refute my hypothesis?

Just because vpfree adheres to the belief that VP machines are fair doesn't mean I shouldn't know how that is calculated and what goes behind the statement. Just accepting a statement as fact doesn't teach you anything.

VPfree also accepts the premise that 9/6 JOB is a 99.54% return ( to 2 decimal places) but a discussion of how you get to that number would certainly be valid.

If I decide to play a little recreational roulette ( like the $0.25 game at the Westin 5-8 M - Th) and I bet on 17 and 60 spins go by without a 17, what does that tell me? How about 100 spins? 200 spins?
I think this is an excellent topic for VP Free. Just because some people will get all wound up on the topic doesn't mean it shouldn't be discussed.

One vote to open this topic up to discussion.

--- In vpFREE@yahoogroups.com, vpFREE Administrator <vpfree3355@...> wrote:
>
> From the vpFREE FAQ:
>
> "vpFREE believes that video poker games which are regulated
> by respected gaming commissions are random and fair, and
> that the ER of such games is a mathematical function of
> their pay tables."
>
>
> I've deleted Frank Kneeland's "What Would It Take???" post on vpFREE and re-posted it on FREEvpFREE.
>
> Formulating the required parameters to mathematically prove, or disprove,the randomness of video poker offerings is an interesting and important subject, but it may not have widespread interest for vpFREE members and it would likely prove to be disruptive.
>

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[vpFREE] Re: Palms NSUD - MIA

 

Yes. Those are the ones I used to play. In fact those 2 machines have been removed altogether, while the others in the middle of the floor are still present but downgraded to 15/9.

--- In vpFREE@yahoogroups.com, "tomflush" <tomflush@...> wrote:
>
> there use to be 2 in the HR room, are they gone too ?
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "dbsb3233" <dbsb3233@...>
> To: <vpFREE@yahoogroups.com>
> Sent: Sunday, March 18, 2012 11:46 AM
> Subject: [vpFREE] Re: Palms NSUD - MIA
>
>
> >
> >
> > Well son of a bitch. I'm staying there this week and the $2 5-play was
> > going to be my play there. I only started playing it on a trip late last
> > year and was looking forward to it being a regular play.
> >
> > Crap. Looks like a won't be playing there anymore.
> >
> >
> > --- In vpFREE@yahoogroups.com, "Don the Dentist" <dds6@> wrote:
> >>
> >> The $1/$2 3/5 play machines on the floor no longer contain NSUD. They
> >> have been downgraded to Airport Deuces/Illinois Deuces/pNSUD (98.91%).
> >>
> >> Don the Dentist
> >>
> >
> >
> >
> > ------------------------------------
> >
> > vpFREE Links: http://www.west-point.org/users/usma1955/20228/V/Links.htm
> >
> > Yahoo! Groups Links
> >
> >
> >
>

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Re: [vpFREE] Re: Palms NSUD - MIA

 

there use to be 2 in the HR room, are they gone too ?

----- Original Message -----
From: "dbsb3233" <dbsb3233@gmail.com>
To: <vpFREE@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Sunday, March 18, 2012 11:46 AM
Subject: [vpFREE] Re: Palms NSUD - MIA

>
>
> Well son of a bitch. I'm staying there this week and the $2 5-play was
> going to be my play there. I only started playing it on a trip late last
> year and was looking forward to it being a regular play.
>
> Crap. Looks like a won't be playing there anymore.
>
>
> --- In vpFREE@yahoogroups.com, "Don the Dentist" <dds6@...> wrote:
>>
>> The $1/$2 3/5 play machines on the floor no longer contain NSUD. They
>> have been downgraded to Airport Deuces/Illinois Deuces/pNSUD (98.91%).
>>
>> Don the Dentist
>>
>
>
>
> ------------------------------------
>
> vpFREE Links: http://www.west-point.org/users/usma1955/20228/V/Links.htm
>
> Yahoo! Groups Links
>
>
>

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Re: [vpFREE] Re: What Would It Take???

 

At 08:32 AM 3/18/2012, you wrote:

Hi Dan!

I continue to love your VP software! I wish I had more time to
pursue it, but survival with my business takes priority. Just keep
pushing the limits as to what is possible, concerning VP mathematics!

Dave

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[vpFREE] Re: What Would It Take???

 

I understand. I only wanted to talk about how one would go about being sure for one's self of one's position regardless of which side of the argument one was on.

I certainly didn't want to start any conflict on the subject.

I agree with and support your decision to move the thread.

I will make a single post on FREEvpFREE to state my position on the subject and then recuse myself from further comment on this topic here or there, since I have no desire to become part of conflagration on this apparently excessively heated topic.

I'm discussing it with some math guys on other forums and will perhaps post a link for a free spreadsheet utility in a month or so. The utility will be merely a booking tool that includes probability functions that tells a person if they ran better or worse than expected...and if so by what margin, and how likely it is that their results could be within the realm of pure chance.

I'm sure some people on this forum might like to use it, so I'll just post the finished product.

(IF ANYONE WOULD LIKE TO EMAIL ME WITH INPUT FOR THE UTILITY PLEASE DO SO PRIVATELY)

(this will be my last comment on this subject) ~FK

--- In vpFREE@yahoogroups.com, vpFREE Administrator <vpfree3355@...> wrote:
>
> Valerie Pollard <vpollard@...> wrote:
>
> > I don't want to start controversy - however I was very
> > interested in Frank's subject matter ...
>
> > ... I would respectfully ask if perhaps the subject might
> > be allowed.
>
> As I posted, I believe this is an interesting and important
> project and would like to see it pursued, but on FREEvpFREE
> rather than on vpFREE.
>
> My decision to move the topic to FREEvpFREE was influenced
> by the first response to Frank Kneeland's post which was
> from Rob Singer (which can be read on FREEvpFREE) with
> personal, controversial observations, and hints of more to
> come, that I didn't want to deal with on vpFREE.
>
> FWIW, in the interests of freedom of speech, Rob Singer is
> allowed to do limited, moderated posting on vpFREE as long as
> he doesn't do any trolling or talk about his system(s) or
> results (which he has already covered in great detail on
> various forums over the years).
>
> IMO, Rob Singer's response didn't violate his posting
> guidelines so I didn't reject it, but I didn't want to open
> any disruptive doors on vpFREE, so I moved the discussion to
> FREEvpFREE.
>
> So, please pursue this discussion, but do it on FREEvpFREE.
>
> vpFREE Administrator
>
>
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>

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[vpFREE] Re: What Would It Take???

 

Since it was important to his business, probably no one in the world knows more about the vagaries of getting royals than Frank. A couple of years ago my wife and I played through a couple of royal flush cycles on a game in which the progressive had gotten very large. In the past, royals had come to us just as often as the naive person would suspect.

When after two royal flush cycles we hadn't gotten a royal, I became very suspicious and asked a friend of mine who was a statistician if he thought the rng in the machines had been gaffed. After a long explanation and a visit to Chi Square distributions, he convinced me that it was more of a miracle that we had been getting our royals with such regularity and going several royal flush cycles with nothing shouldn't be that unexpected.

My wife plays about 800 hands an hour and has not been surprised to get a couple of royals in a day. Like me, however, she was amazed to go two weeks without a royal, but that's just the other side of the distribution. It turns out that you can go a very long time between royals before you have good reason to suspect that the rng has been gaffed.

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[vpFREE] GameKing Attendant Menu

 


In case anyone might be interested...

Since I have a MGMD Touchscreen GameKing machine made in 08-98, I
thought I would post a snapshot of some of the statistical information
available from the Attendant screen. There is way too much to post in
its entirety. I'm only showing the machine master accounting
information. Keep in mind this is just for my machine since I did a
reset and a game setup. We play mostly 25c FPDW (100.76%) and 25c KBJW
(100.65%). We also have the grandkids over who like to play the slot games on
it too. Hopefully I didn't make any typos.

Dennis
vp-connoisseur

ATTENDANT MENU

Accounting
Diagnostics
Play History
Event Logs
Modify Meters
Sound Setup

---Accounting---
Machine Master Accounting
Machine Period Accounting
Multidenomination Accounting
Game Group Accounting
Game Accounting
Paytable Accounting
Security Accounting
Error Accounting
Program Version Information
Bill Accounting
Voucher Accounting
Cashless Info Display

---Machine Master Accounting---
Total played (coins in) $1,329,068.53
Total Won $1,332,769.64
Coins Won (coins out) $1,278,559.64
Jackpot Won (jackpots) $54,210.00
Machine hold -.27%
Machine yield 100.27%

Total Out $56,811.36
Coin out $1711.00
Cash voucher out $0.00
Debit out $0.00
Jackpot handpay $54,210.00
Canceled credits $890.36

Total money to drop $52,760.00
Bills to drop $52,760.00
Coins to drop $0.00
Vouchers to drop $0.00

Hopper fill $1200.00

Total games played 1,004,125
Total games won 450,792
Total games lost 553,333

Physical coins in 1,476
Physical coins out 6,844

Base machine hold % -.27%
Base machine yield 100.27%

System total bonus won $0.00
System deductible bonus won $0.00
System non-deductible bonus won $0.00
System wager match bonus won $0.00
System deductible MJT won $0.00
System non-deductible MJT won $0.00

System total bonuses triggered 0

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[vpFREE] Re: What Would It Take???

 

I agree with the Vpfree moderator's decision and think this subject (no disrespect to Frank Kneeland who has been a great addition to this forum) belongs in a different forum because it would have degenerated into the same worthless long threads that I personally have no use for.

--- In vpFREE@yahoogroups.com, Cardfather@... wrote:
>
>
> As usual, the voice of reason & common sense rings true.
> Thanks, Dan
> CF
> "Age & Treachery shall overcome youth & skill"
>
>
>
>
>
> No serious, mathematically sound discussions allowed. I guess there's no
> real value in this forum any more.
>
>
> "Chance favors the prepared mind" ~ Louis Pasteur
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>

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[vpFREE] Re: Palms NSUD - MIA

 



Well son of a bitch. I'm staying there this week and the $2 5-play was going to be my play there. I only started playing it on a trip late last year and was looking forward to it being a regular play.

Crap. Looks like a won't be playing there anymore.

--- In vpFREE@yahoogroups.com, "Don the Dentist" <dds6@...> wrote:
>
> The $1/$2 3/5 play machines on the floor no longer contain NSUD. They have been downgraded to Airport Deuces/Illinois Deuces/pNSUD (98.91%).
>
> Don the Dentist
>

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