[vpFREE] Re: Bob Dancer's LVA - 8 SEP 2015

 

> From: "'Scot Krause' krauseinvegas@cox.net [vpFREE]"

> Has anyone heard from Frank or have an email address for him? I'm trying to
> send him something.

I haven't seen Frank in about a month but this is the address he used
to use on this forum. Take out the spaces.

frank @ progressivevp . com

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Re: [vpFREE] Re: Bob Dancer's LVA - 8 SEP 2015

 

I think I finally have grasped the concept. In 9/6 Jacks, using a strategy based on a 4000 coin royal the frequency is 40,391. That would be the 99.54% version. You would be taking a 2.45% drop between royals.

Using a strategy based on a 2888 coin royal (this would be a 99% game, not including the 1% meter) stretches the royal odds out to 47,245. But you would only be taking a 2.18% drop between royals.

The 99.54% version has a cost of $4950 per royal. The 99% version has a cost of $5150 per royal. That's a $200 difference. But with the 99% version you would generate an extra $343 in meter movement per royal.

This would hardly seem worth it to me. But I think Frank was working in the era when there were lots of stronger meters. I think they were playing a lot of 8/5 Jacks with 2% and 3% meters.

The strongest royal meter I've ever seen was on a bank of 2 Pair Pays Even Money Tens or Better at Harvey's in Lake Tahoe in the late nineties. This game was just 90% but it had a 10% royal meter on it. I seen at least one team working that bank.

And I think Frank said that they only used the min-cost strategy when things were slow. If they had another location to send the team to after the royal was hit they wouldn't use it. .

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Re: [vpFREE] Re: Bob Dancer's LVA - 8 SEP 2015

 


I'll intercede for just a second ...

Relax. Min-cost RF strategy has been discussed here a few times before (and details are included in the group FAQ).

It applies to any play. Progressives represent a special case.

Generally speaking, application to a standard play doesn't result in largely significant strategy changes (or "appreciable" added expected win/RF -- I'll define "appreciable" as meaning little change to your overall ROR ... note: noti may likely differ in perception of what "little" represents).

The preceding tends to be true because you're likely playing a near 100% (say 99%+) game already. However, if (for example) you're playing a 98% game with 2% in added cash benefits, then the concept can again be quite relevant.

Strategy adoption with progressives presume a "monopoly" situation because if you're going to factor in the benefit of a 1% or 2% meter as an "absolute", you'd pretty much better have the ultimate win locked up. (I imagine you might augment the math to factor "probability of win", but I don't believe that's been discussed here.)

I'll turn the discussion back to whoever cares to add ;)

- H.

---In vpFREE@yahoogroups.com, <bobbartop@...> wrote :

Wait a minute, my own question is confusing me. You included non-progressives too. My head hurts.


---In vpFREE@yahoogroups.com mailto:vpFREE@yahoogroups.com, <bobbartop@...> wrote :

Again, please dumb it down for me one more time. Is this scenario ONLY when you have the jackpot locked up, either as a team or with someone to trade off with you but not let any outsiders gain access? Thanks.








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Re: [vpFREE] Re: Bob Dancer's LVA - 8 SEP 2015

 

Wait a minute, my own question is confusing me. You included non-progressives too. My head hurts.


---In vpFREE@yahoogroups.com, <bobbartop@...> wrote :

Again, please dumb it down for me one more time. Is this scenario ONLY when you have the jackpot locked up, either as a team or with someone to trade off with you but not let any outsiders gain access? Thanks.







[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

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Re: [vpFREE] Re: Bob Dancer's LVA - 8 SEP 2015

 

Again, please dumb it down for me one more time. Is this scenario ONLY when you have the jackpot locked up, either as a team or with someone to trade off with you but not let any outsiders gain access? Thanks.



---In vpFREE@yahoogroups.com, <nightoftheiguana2000@...> wrote :

This is min-cost-royal strategy. It works for non-progressives as well. In addition to counting the meter rate (zero for non-progressives or a progressive that has hit the cap) you also count all incentives, like cash back, estimated future mailers, estimated drawing values, sales from casino swag on ebay, and so on. Over 2.05% the royal is zero, which is the strategy that maximizes the return of the non-royal hands.

Summary:

at zero incentives, set Royal = 974 bets
at 1% incentives, set Royal = 580 bets
at 2% incentives, set Royal = 50 bets (same as straight flush)
over 2.05% incentives, set Royal = 0 (max-non-royals strategy)

Put these royal values into a strategy generator like the wizard's and you get min-cost-royal strategy.

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Re: [vpFREE] Re: Bob Dancer's LVA - 8 SEP 2015

 

This is min-cost-royal strategy. It works for non-progressives as well. In addition to counting the meter rate (zero for non-progressives or a progressive that has hit the cap) you also count all incentives, like cash back, estimated future mailers, estimated drawing values, sales from casino swag on ebay, and so on. Over 2.05% the royal is zero, which is the strategy that maximizes the return of the non-royal hands.

Summary:

at zero incentives, set Royal = 974 bets
at 1% incentives, set Royal = 580 bets
at 2% incentives, set Royal = 50 bets (same as straight flush)
over 2.05% incentives, set Royal = 0 (max-non-royals strategy)

Put these royal values into a strategy generator like the wizard's and you get min-cost-royal strategy.

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

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[vpFREE] LV Advisor Top Ten Values - 10 SEP 2015

 

LV Advisor Top Ten Values - 10 SEP 2015

The latest LV Advisor Top 10 Values List can be accessed
via vpFREE Links or at:

http://www.lasvegasadvisor.com/topten.cfm

************************************************

This link is posted for informational purposes and doesn't
constitute an endorsement or approval of the linked article's
content by vpFREE. Any discussion of the article must be done
in accordance with vpFREE's rules and policies.

************************************************

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[vpFREE] vpFREE Forums - 10 SEP 2015

 

vpFREE Forums - 10 SEP 2015

The following vpFREE video poker forums are available
on Yahoo! Groups:

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FREEvpFREE
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Regional Forums

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The forums can be accessed from the vpFREE home
page and from vpFREE Links or at:

http://www.west-point.org/users/usma1955/20228/V/LIST.htm

All of the forums are fully operational and open for
business. Anyone who has a Yahoo ID can join and get
immediate access. New members are moderated until
they have made an initial on-topic post (this deters
spammers who aren't all that bright).

SIGN UP NOW for any of the vpFREE forums that are of
interest.

vpFREE Administrator

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[vpFREE] IQDB when Replying to vpFREE Posts - 10 SEP 2015

 

IQDB when Replying to vpFREE Posts - 10 SEP 2015

IDENTIFY who wrote what. Clearly differentiate between the
message you're replying to and your comments.

QUOTE just enough of the message you're replying to in order
to provide continuity. Less is best.

DELETE everything else from the previous message.

BRIGHTEN up the Administrator's day by practicing good
etiquette when replying to posts.

vpFREE Administrator

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Re: [vpFREE] Re: Bob Dancer's LVA - 8 SEP 2015

 

Thank you.




---In vpFREE@yahoogroups.com, <007@...> wrote :

The value of a progressive play is maximized if the jackpot is assumed
to be at the point at which the payback is 100%, including meter
movement. This assumes that there's no chance of quitting the play,
getting kicked off, or running out of money and there will be no
competition and no other reason that the player won't have it all to
himself until he hits it. It also assumes there is no cost to the
additional time spent by playing more conservatively and that no
players on the team will get paid, make any mistakes, steal, etc.
Take 9/6 Jacks or Better with a 1% meter. It doesn't matter how high
it is. A 5 x $1 non-progressive breaks even at around $4872 and pays
back 99% at something like $2900. Playing as if the meter were fixed
at $2900 maximizes the value of the play.





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