<<But gambling losses can be deducted from gambling winnings, as
your guy should know, at least for federal, and for some states as well. >>
But only if you itemize!!
________________
Jean $¢ott, Frugal Gambler
http://queenofcomps.com/
You can read my blog at
http://jscott.lvablog.com/
"Refer to post 111265..."
Dr. Don, wouldn't it have been easier just to say, "Yes!" I missed your answer the first time around, but what really bothers me if how many posts that are less informative are reposted again and again. Well, I'm off to floss.
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Marvin,
As far as my comment is concerned, I am only telling you what I would do,
Marvin, not what YOU should do.
I can tell you that I am NOT a tax professional and therefore I cannot give
you advice.
Unless you won a huge amount, I don't think you will have a problem, but
then again, I do not know your situation.
My advice:
Ask your tax professional and follow their advice.
Bruce Stewart
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Sometimes
--- In vpFREE@yahoogroups.com, <vpstarr1@...> wrote:
>
> Are the 4 letter words really necessary to a productive discussion?
>
simpsonmarvin wrote:
>
> I am new to Video Poker but I had a good year in 2010 and received a
> couple of W-2G forms.
> The fellow who does my taxes told me I had to pay tax on the total
> as I have no other records.
>
> I think I am stuck for last year but I have vowed to get religion
> this year and keep some sort of diary.
>
> What is the best way to do it?
My reply echos some of what has already been offered up ...
The average joe in your shoes, in preparing a return, might easily submit a "best guess" of losses as a deduction against the W-2G reported wins (in absence of firm documented losses). Failure to do otherwise would result in a tax liability of $1000+ greater than otherwise due.
But you'll be hard pressed to find a certified tax preparer who will take such a position without appropriate records. In signing your return, they're indicating their willingness to appear to defend the return in the event of an examination.
The IRS has been explicit in requiring a "contemporaneous" gaming record, supported by any other appropriate documents, to backup loss deductions when questioned. End of year casino win/loss statements are rejected as sufficient documentation (as are many "after the fact" reconstructions).
The risk of an audit, triggered merely by moderate reported gaming activity is slim, at most. (I know of audits only in the case of someone filing as a professional gambler, or where the accounting used resulted in reported gross wins less than total reported w-2G's.) But a professional preparer won't take even that risk.
I won't advise you on how to proceed. I'll note that even in the event of an audit, your additional liability would likely be limited to the underpaid tax as a consequence of the denied deduction, appropriate interest (@ something like 7%/yr), and in the worst case, a penalty of up to 50% of the underpaid tax. However, in many cases, if you can demonstrate that you reasonably estimated the undocumented losses, any penalties often are fully forgiven.
----------------------------------------------------------
As far as what constitutes an acceptable gaming log, here's the excerpted discussion from IRS Publication 529:
Gambling Losses Up to the Amount of Gambling Winnings
You must report the full amount of your gambling winnings for the year on Form 1040, line 21. You deduct your gambling losses for the year on Schedule A (Form 1040), line 28. You cannot deduct gambling losses that are more than your winnings.
You cannot reduce your gambling winnings by your gambling losses and report the difference. You must report the full amount of your winnings as income and claim your losses (up to the amount of winnings) as an itemized deduction. Therefore, your records should show your winnings separately from your losses.
Diary of winnings and losses. You must keep an accurate diary or similar record of your losses and winnings.
Your diary should contain at least the following information.
* The date and type of your specific wager or wagering activity.
* The name and address or location of the gambling establishment.
* The names of other persons present with you at the gambling establishment.
* The amount(s) you won or lost.
Proof of winnings and losses. In addition to your diary, you should also have other documentation. You can generally prove your winnings and losses through Form W-2G, Certain Gambling Winnings, Form 5754, Statement by Person(s) Receiving Gambling Winnings, wagering tickets, canceled checks, substitute checks, credit records, bank withdrawals, and statements of actual winnings or payment slips provided to you by the gambling establishment.
For specific wagering transactions, you can use the following items to support your winnings and losses.
These recordkeeping suggestions are intended as general guidelines to help you establish your winnings and losses. They are not all-inclusive. Your tax liability depends on your particular facts and circumstances.
Slot machines. A record of the machine number and all winnings by date and time the machine was played.
Well, once more I am going to try to get to the lunch. I leave on the
22nd for London (anyone know anything about VP there? I'm basically a quarter
player so don't want to get too involved but it might be fun to play a
little). I expect my foot will be pretty much normal by then (had surgery yet
again and the outcome looks very good at this point). More information
than you wanted but hey, what are online friends for?
Karen
Nobody can make you feel inferior without your consent - Eleanor Roosevelt
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Independent casino third party verification seems better than my own hand
written records which are more likely to have nmistakes.
If they want hand written records, just conform them to casino records.
Sheesh! The IRS is even more ridiculous than I thought.
I sure wouldn't let them gyp me out of declaring legitimate losses over
something as silly as this!
B
In a message dated 2/1/2011 9:03:19 P.M. Pacific Standard Time,
takeme2london@gmail.com writes:
technically, win/loss statements are not valid documentation of your win
or loss, according to the IRS.
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
technically, win/loss statements are not valid documentation of your win or loss, according to the IRS.
the IRS requires you to keep a contemporaneous diary, including details of "cash-in," machine numbers, names of those who visited the casino with you (if any) and "cash-out, among other details relating to each gambling session.
if you've gambled heavily, it's also a good idea to keep documentation to substantiate where your money came from... ATM receipts, casino marker receipts and so forth.
as for the IRS expecting you to lose... perhaps. but many of their rules are not clearly defined... and most of the folks at the IRS are clueless about gambling... it's very hard for them to understand how you can have a 10K or 20K W2-G generating event playing $5 coin and still walk away at a loss for that 'session."
--- In vpFREE@yahoogroups.com, BCarStew@... wrote:
>
> If you had your card inserted in the machine, the casinos will have a
> record of your wins and also your losses. Just call them up and they will
> mail/fax it to you. You can legally apply any losses against any wins.
>
> I believe the IRS almost "expects" you to lose. After all, they know the
> odds are with the House.
>
> a message dated 2/1/2011 5:59:16 P.M. Pacific Standard Time,
> simpsonmarvin@... writes:
>
> I am new to Video Poker but I had a good year in 2010 and received a couple
> of W-2G forms. The fellow who does my taxes told me I had to pay tax on the total as I
> have no other records.
>
> I think I am stuck for last year but I have vowed to get religion this
> year and keep some sort of diary.
Marvin,
If you had your card inserted in the machine, the casinos will have a
record of your wins and also your losses. Just call them up and they will
mail/fax it to you. You can legally apply any losses against any wins.
I believe the IRS almost "expects" you to lose. After all, they know the
odds are with the House.
Good Luck!
Bruce Stewart
a message dated 2/1/2011 5:59:16 P.M. Pacific Standard Time,
simpsonmarvin@ymail.com writes:
I am new to Video Poker but I had a good year in 2010 and received a couple
of W-2G forms.
The fellow who does my taxes told me I had to pay tax on the total as I
have no other records.
I think I am stuck for last year but I have vowed to get religion this
year and keep some sort of diary.
What is the best way to do it?
Marvin S
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
First of the the guy who does your taxes, is right, kind of. Undoubtedly, you
also lost some money at the casinos you played at, even those you got the W2G's
from. Perhaps not net losses there, but you didn't win every hand. If you were
playing with a players card, you can request a win-loss form from each casino
you played at. The ones where there were W2G's will give you a win-loss
statement that includes those W2G figures.
You can total up all the numbers on your w/l statements and see how much you
actually won. But gambling losses can be deducted from gambling winnings, as
your guy should know, at least for federal, and for some states as well.
Obviously, you don't want to pay on your total W2G amounts, if you have some
losses that offset those winnings. At least you'll reduce the amount you have to
pay.
Going forward, you should be keeping a record of cash in, winnings, cash out,
etc. There have been numerous discussions of this in the past, or you could look
into Jean Scott's fine book that deals with taxes and VP.
Certainly the game is rigged. Don't let that stop you; if you don't bet, you
can't win. -Lazarus Long
In theory, there is no difference between theory and practice. But, in practice,
there is. -Yogi Berra
There is no such thing as luck. There is only adequate or inadequate preparation
to cope with a statistical universe. -Robert Heinlein
________________________________
I am new to Video Poker but I had a good year in 2010 and received a couple of
W-2G forms.
The fellow who does my taxes told me I had to pay tax on the total as I have no
other records.
I think I am stuck for last year but I have vowed to get religion this year and
keep some sort of diary.
What is the best way to do it?
Marvin S
_
,_._,___
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
It's a great read starting off with the LVH progressive of years gone by. Good investment in $30 and reading time. Frank autographed my copy so maybe if you ask....:-)
He really lived the Life sometimes 4 days straight with eyes wide open.
--- In vpFREE@yahoogroups.com, "Martin" <martinvegas@...> wrote:
>
> Hi All
>
> Has anyone had a chance to peruse the new LVA volume,The Secret World of Video Poker Progressives by Frank Kneeland?
>
> Regards.
>
--- In vpFREE@yahoogroups.com, Meredith And Kenny <meredithandkenny@...> wrote:
>
>
> V.O. was my Dads drink of choice, along with Beer as a chaser ? I never got that one, maybe Mickey can shed some light. V.O. is very good with a light soda (for me, diet sprite)..if I were to drink a cocktail with whiskey, it's the only one that I can drink. All of the others burn too much !
I think I will see if I can find a place to get a VO and ginger ale on my next visit to Vegas. I'll sip on that, think of Mickey's stories, and smile....
Dave
--- In vpFREE@yahoogroups.com, "Mickey" <mickeycrimm@...> wrote:
But I remember seeing a quarter bank of 6-7-8 at Station Casino....and having to turn around and walk off because I didn't have the money to play.
>
In my early days of VP play, this happened to me all the time. I was a super-novice, but I recall seeing a bank of dollar FPDW (I believe it was at Barbary Coast, ca. 2002) and shaking my head, knowing the game was positive, especially with the club benefits, and knowing I had no business sitting there, with my $80 daily bankroll. I did pretty well, chasing coupons and drinking like a fish, but I couldn't play that game.
Dave
